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This website makes me wanna take up moonshining so I can bootstrap an alcohol addiction.

Sorry for being right I won’t post again

nah you were almost there you're just wrong about electron

Wait. Are you pro-electron?

Sobbing, wailing, beating my chest, as I realize I'm gonna have to block moot.

from a dev perspective electron is probably the worst framework I have ever used but open standards are good so it's directionally correct from a user perspective it's completely fine lol

Each app uses so much memory and disk space, tho.

memory could be improved, disk space is whatever my beef with electron haters is they seem more interested in retvrnposting for closed platforms than solving real problems

I am an electron hater, I absolutely do NOT want to retvrn, I hate Electron because it's a shit solution to a problem that shouldn't exist. GUI frameworks shouldn't be this fragmentory and inconsistent. Vendors should give devs a stable target that if they hit it, they can expect things to just work

Instead every platform has its own opinions on what works and what doesn't, they're changing all the time, and the methods for interfacing with them are either ancient and asinine or just plain don't work for a ton of things.

Especially with Windows, their GUI frameworks have so many neglected, forgotten, or just seemingly unnecessary and incomplete components that it feels like a Google product.

correct on all counts, but sighing and exclaiming "if only trillion-dollar companies would stop trying to make platform plays" is not a winning strategy the cool thing about the web is it actually worked, we won, the question should now be "how do we make it better"

This is actually the most convincing argument for electron it has heard (it still hates the memory usage of electron mind). You know, you're right.

All these arguments would work for Tauri or Wails, tho

They don't actually. Speaking from just recently having been deep diving on all three: Tauri and Wails both do something different per platform, trying to find a web engine that sucks least in each platform. Electron ships CEF (aka chromium-ish) on EVERY platform. It's a noteworthy difference...

...both because of consistency of your development target, for the developers using it; And also because Tauri and Wails are stuck with least-common-denominator APIs between all their supported engines... Which contains some clusterfucks I'm still learning about as we speak but lemme say "it's bad"

it's unfortunate there aren't more alternatives as electron really does kinda suck there's also electrobun but I'm not sure its status given @yoav.codes seems to have some, uh, principled disagreements regarding Bun's development model

12k stars. New apps sent to me every day, 50 in the readme that people have built Electrobun 2.0 in active development. Use bun, node, deno, zig, rust, or go for the main process. Active talks with aligned acquihirer and open source VC to ensure long life. About to release Dash alpha & cottontail

thanks for clarifying I was somewhat surprised to hear of your dissent on the vibe port given you adopted an agent-heavy workflow for electrobun pretty early

I just want them to read the code. I could care less that they use AI. I use lots of tools including agents all the time. But I’m not gonna cut a release and ship a million lines of slop no one has read to end user’s machines. Anthropic making bun a marketing gimmick for tokenmaxxing is a tragedy

It’s also not too late for them to come to their senses. I had a back and forth with Jarred a couple days ago on twitter explaining my position and he still does not want humans reading all the code. He also has been unable to write a blog post justifying this recklessness. So might change his mind

do you think it was primarily a marketing endeavor? I'm inclined to agree but many seemed willing to take the port at face value I found it pretty hard to ignore the subtext of zig's ai stance

Would you change your stance at some point in the future if you felt like the development standards were satisfactory?