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to weigh in on the arcade game discourse earnestly: i’ve been slowly getting into them more and more lately, playing both shmups and beat em ups, having a great time with both and i think they’re extremely inviting and fun and rewarding even and arguably especially at lower skill levels

A lot of what attracts people to continues can easily be solved by robust practice modes now that we all own the games we buy. Its more benefitial to push the practice culture arcade players already engage with (through save states), then the alternative

i just dunno if that’s true? i think continues have specific design benefits beyond practice modes. being able to play a run out after a death for practice while you’re doing attempts or slowly reducing the credits you need to clear are two, to me, valid and healthy approaches that you’d lose

The word limit of these websites is horrendous

i guess ultimately i think the ambiguity is a trade off; enforcing modes of play will reduce ambiguity and thus bad posts from people disingenuous to the genre like the one that started all this discourse but will it actually make those people engage more deeply or just turn them away?

For a lot, turning away, but turning away is temporary for some, some people later in life develop a taste for the style,etc. Dark souls turned a lot of people away at first too But if you dont see the game as a real choice, you will never second guess yourself, thats what continues did

There is also the aspect of, maybe its good to turn a lot away as long as some can be caught falling between the track. Its just not healthy that to get into Arcade games, you need to go through a cultural reprogramming by MarkMSX/Boghog/Me/DevInterviews/Friends/DerekYu

i guess i just don’t think you need much reprogramming? my intent with my posts was to say, to people intimidated by the genre, that i think these games are much more accessible and easy to get into than their reputation suggests. they were made to be played by literally anyone

I agree with that part, there are a very wide variety of arcade games, that can also accomodate a steady progression. But my point is that people cant find those, because they dont see them as real games. If you dont see something as a real game worth your attention, nothing in it matters

yeah absolutely i think we’re all looking for ways in which that bridge can be crossed, to get others to see what we see in these games. and this isn’t a solved question at all so every arcade style game that releases into the modern market is going to try to solve this in different ways

I agree, which is why I think its useful to look at modern examples. Final Vendetta added continues under the pressure of Steam forums, and Devil Daggers did not. Obviously not a perfect comparison for variety of reasons, but people talk about them differently

There is a level of respect DD gets even from people who hate it, because they couldnt trivialize it, meanwhile If you look at the steam forums, Final vendetta is very much marked with "dumb button masher to play for an hour"