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Holy shit. I did not see this coming. This changes everything. They decoupled semantic intelligence from text generation. This is an AI that is as smart as Fable, but which is structurally incapable of threatening the liberal arts.

mr. TIM@timkellogg.me

Jev: Fable-level model that doesn’t charge for output tokens because they’re too cheap to meter it’s not general though, it only makes decisions, doesn’t generate text, but input tokens are measured by the billion ($42/btok) typesafe.ai/blog/introdu...

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that seems not true? it's certainly capable of 'threatening' the liberal arts (just to mirror that language). super cool tho.

But the point is still strong: we can build systems on this that are no “threat” in the sense I mean, in a way that we have heretofore struggled to do with LLMs for various reasons.

I feel like it is strange to think of liberal arts in terms of culture-production lol, we're not talking about fine arts here.

it sure feels like it could hypothetically do a whole lot of wacky shit to grading, admissions screening, editorial selection, moderation, archival classification, document interpretation, semantic search, curation, peer-review triage, rubric assessment, etc etc

I think people are equating fine arts with liberal arts here, liberal arts is basically everything that is not engineering or trades

i think they need to talk more shop because I have no idea what they're actually doing different from an architecture standpoint for this to "not be an LLM" in a meaningful way not that it's impossible just that i don't understand how currently

okay, so other than the trivial "have it choose which token to generate, heh": this seems like it might have obvious implications for a hybrid model, where you have a smaller LLM that generates both text to fill things in and sets of choices for the Jev-type model to choose between

This will make a lot of blue teamers very happy. We've had so many folks getting burned out by alert fatigue/IR/etc., having the robots running in multiple different directions gathering data and firing off runbooks before you even open your laptop is gonna really feel like the future.

I don't quite understand yet. it seems like this takes in a bounded set of options and just makes an educated decision, but like... so can anyone? we all do the same thing. every single person would come up with a different (decision, reason) tuple given the same inputs, and that's a good thing.

is the utility of this model just that it does it in ~100ms? or is it supposedly able to do it more effectively in every domain than like 95% of experts in those domains, or something (and while not 100%, 95% is damn good, which makes it have generalizable knowledge)?

Yes, people all do the same thing. That’s kind of the point of AI, to make computers do things that humans do automatically. :3 The utility from a technical perspective is that it scores about as high across domains as the best LLMs, while being much cheaper and faster.

I mean it is concerning to see this in juxtaposition with OpenAI saying that they think chain-of-thought monitoring is our only hope But yes it is true that I was pessimistic about that plan to begin with

its cool. i always liked constrained generation for LLMs to drive NFAs and now its a thing i wonder what we can trade off now? smaller models? or just faster inference? i havent read any of the details

As far as AI knowers are concerned, you’re correct. As far as policy is concerned, this provides a way to “put AI into everything” that doesn’t tend to collapse into “replace human-generated content with AI-generated content”. This is a political opportunity (even) more than a technical one.

There are lots of threats; the point is that this invention provides a version of AI that is non-threatening*. * enough for political leverage

I want to note that this isn't totally new. functiongemma does the same thing except it's much smaller, optimized to live on cell phones, and the idea is you fine-tune it for specific tasks like turning natural language into a set of cell phone commands like flashlight on, WiFi on, volume down, etc

This is really going to throw a wrench into "stochastic parrot theory". How can it be a stochastic parrot if all it does is an elaborate set of mathematical equations, producing a statistical probability, with no words involved except the ones we feed in?

Do you mean Bender and Gebru’s position on how LLMs interact with meaning, or do you mean the phrase as used dismissively by anti-AI posters? This doesn’t threaten the former, and the latter is hardly a “theory”.

Fuck, this might actually be a path towards GOFAI and away from ANNs-do-everything Yudkowsky you sickening bastard you’ve done it again

If it works as described/marketed, this definitely fits better for my data-engineering shaped workflows rather than trying to force Sonnet/Opus into outputting JSON or values, and much better priced too

I say this as a fool who barely knows what they're talking about, but I have always envisioned a very powerful shift away from "text generation is used for literally everything and we leave it at that"

I honestly just didn’t think we’d get it before society collapsed lol. It was always a possibility, but line go up fast!

I still fondly remember the early days of the neural network boom at the turn of this decade, and for a while, voice models and even image models seemed to steal the thunder of gimmicky autocomplete and even more gimmicky chatbot applications... I want this world to come roaring back lol

(I guess IP challenges make it tougher, but it is weird to me that work on AI voices was so advanced and seems to have kinda stalled for several years now... I genuinely suspect that Twitter cosplayers getting polarized against AI destroyed their audience lmfao)

only multiple-choice? that's a bit less useful than i imagined i was thinking it did constrained generation, so you could point the harness a syntax and it would generate that but yea "write a novel as xhtml" would then work, too

Game of Life in Game of Life lmao Yes, “structurally incapable” is overselling it. But it’s close enough for politics, and it’s a version of “frontier-level AI” that writers and artists may not feel existentially threatened by.

isn't this more like, at least on paper, what typesafe is itself describing it as - a "frontier-intelligence function call" deliberately restricted to narrow judgments or specifically bounded semantic decisions?

So basically a pure classifier on an LLM backbone? As a scientist I would find it useful for plugging into "crystallized" workflows, removing need to sanity check or parse, while also appreciating generative outputs for other purposes. My main question would be if it can assess confidence?

(They claim it "can't hallucinate". That's... a very large claim, as the classifier equivalent of "hallucination" would be any kind of ML edge artifact, overtraining or bias effect resulting in confident-seeming mispredictions on novel data. I'd not trust that without exhaustive verification.)