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People get confused about the trans sports thing because at a glance it seems like a small issue that impacts a very small number of people and thus makes sense as a "reasonable" concession. But it isn't, because conceding that is accepting that a kid's trans identity is on some level fraudulent

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The current situation is, I guess, vastly preferable to girls not being able to play sports at all. But youth sports in particular would be better for everyone if they were integrated. Maybe boys could learn to respect girls better.

This is really what the argument feels like: "well, boys are too emotional and dangerous to be trusted around girls." Like it's less about trans kids and more about how these people are afraid of raising boys differently. If only something like feminism existed that could explain that.

Hmm... not sure if that logic is as progressive as you may think. What happens if basketball condenses to just one gender-neutral team?

For teen sports? It's just a game for kids to be active and get exercise. For professional sports? There are much worse problems need fixing with the major professional sports like basketball before you can consider them a legitimate measure of the limits of human abilities.

There’s no reasonable eroding of rights. Plus it targets girls/women & female sports. Aren’t making men/boys jump through hoops to go to the bathroom or play sports. Only females are be questioned or harassed over their looks, to get them to look more female. Plus target women’s sports like the WNBA

there are hoops trans men had to jump through (Theraputic Use Exemptions because of testosterone) to be in men's sports. but lately, those TUEs aren't being issued to trans men so pretty much all the trans men in sports you see now are forced into womens sports and prevented from transitioning

As soon as there are feminine and masculine qualities, nobody can BE a full human. NO full human can tolerate #ArmageddonCapitalism You have to suppress HALF of everyone's cognition to keep the "money is good" scam going on a planet ALL humans can feel breaking down from sadistic over-extraction

Also, from a purely cynical point of view, you’re conceding ground for absolutely nothing in return. It’s not like the transphobes will ever agree that it’s far enough

IMO sports is a tough venue to be having these policy battles in because they sit downstream of so many other issues that haven't yet achieved wide consensus. I'm for letting kids play with whatever gender they identify as and leaving it on opponents to reliably quantify how they have some kind of

allegedly unfair advantage over their peers based on results data (I've yet to see anything like this), but way too many people still don't: • accept that gender as a self-defined identity trait is valid as a concept • accept that it should be the determinative factor for sports segregation (rather

than biological birth sex) • accept that kids should even be allowed to choose their own gender • accept that kids who identify as a gender different from their birth sex should be allowed to reinforce that decision with medical solutions I think trans rights advocates need to convince many more

skeptics through persuasion before anyone can expect supportive policy to not be hugely contentious and prone to passionate backlash. Like it or not, this stuff is toxic to a 9-digit number of Americans who simply don't interact directly with trans rights advocates at all, much less actual trans

For me its the accepting a small number as a reasonable concession. Once rights become a reasonable concession, every group that isn't a majority should rightly fear if they are small enough for their rights to be the next concession.

Which is exactly why they've turned it into the Most Important Issue Facing America. It's not because they give a shit about youth - especially girls - sports. They obviously do not!

They use it to make participation harder, have women/girls/LGBTQ face harassment for their looks, lessen participation & then end female sports as too LGBTQ positive. Don’t support or attend female sports, except to complain. Aren’t protecting women, are discriminating.

Once you've granted the idea that it's dangerous to allow trans kids to play organized sports, you're already 99% of the way to agreeing to bathroom bans. You've stipulated to the transphobes' central argument.

Here's my point, we all breathe oxygen, resperate and need to pee, truth do you look at the person next to you while doing a human function, my wife would just jump on ole porcelain while I was shaving, ITS NOT A BIG DEAL If, it is a big deal It's the bathroom Look in the mirror It's you

Scapegoating marginal groups is how fascism demonstrates expanding oppression for its intimidating minority control. There is no way to meet this abuse "in the middle" without enabling more of it. bsky.app/profile/ianb...

Ian Boudreau@ianboudreau.com

Once you've granted the idea that it's dangerous to allow trans kids to play organized sports, you're already 99% of the way to agreeing to bathroom bans. You've stipulated to the transphobes' central argument.

The problem with this argumentation on your behalf is that the people who need to understand it are not ready to admit conceptual throughline or material conditions matter. They live in a world where each of these debates are separate issues in a vacuum you can have a convo about in a college class.

It's explicitly a stalking horse for education (college and under) and employment (everyone else) discrimination. Which are the main kinds of discrimination. They have at times been very very explicit that they want to use trans participation sports as a wedge to undermine and overturn Title IX!

if anyone reading this belongs to a minority group, how would you feel if a progressive darling endorsed one of the most persistent libels against you and gave a plausibly deniable endorsement to a policy that retracted your rights?

They really don't, they push their religious conservatism however they can, even by pretending it's not religiously driven. From 2017.

You are ignoring this is an 80/20 issue where many people-- women, liberals, parents, athletes, Democrats-- do not want gender id overriding sex when sex is the relevant divisor. In sports male sex, regardless of self image, confers advantages.

Disagree with you there. They’ve turned it into the Most Important Issue Facing America because it does exactly what it’s doing: it divides the Democratic coalition, and unites the right.

Someone's trans identity directly flies in the face of the American Christian's belief in god and their religion as a whole and because of that they can never accept it as being anything other than fraudulent.

Also, so many of these people obsessed with school sports will use any little bit they're given to start terrorizing any girl or boy who doesn't conform to how they think a boy or girl should look. They'll be wanting legal permission to peek in underpants.It's just the first step on a horrible road.

Absolutely. If you're going to commit to the bit, you've got to go all the way. You can't say "the emperor's new clothes are stunning, but we would like him to cover his genitals when the parade passes the kindergarten." He's got to swing his junk along the whole route or the schtick falls apart.

Also, not for nothing but the petition filed a week ago asking the Supreme Court to "review" the DC Circuit ruling that Trump & Hegseth can't kick trans ppl out of the military refers directly to the recent SCOTUS ruling on trans student athletes. Seventeen times. It's never "just" about anything.

Chris Geidner@chrisgeidner.bsky.social

UPDATE: DOJ filed a petition for certiorari on August 27 seeking Supreme Court review of the DC Circuit ruling discussed below. Docket: www.supremecourt.gov/docket/docke... Question presented by DOJ:

It's the typical cynical GOP play on a small minority - electorally unimportant as a constituency but ethically abhorrent demands, aimed at forcing a surrender of basic values. It's not reasonable at all, I totally agree, it's just cynical.

Picking winning battles doesn't mean conceding the war. The places to defend trans rights are ones that are likely to lead to victories. Focus on jobs, justice, housing. Those will yield results that are just as valuable on a symbolic level but much more tangible.

Gay marriage was the tip of the spear for gay rights. It was controversial back in the day to not lead with less popular facets of gay life, but winning on marriage created a base of support for gay people to have the same rights as anybody.

And the hyperfocus on gay marriage left a *lot* of poorer & racialized gay people behind, to a degree that has yet to be rectified Trans communities have learned from that and are trying to prevent a repeat there, as part of the reason here

Trans sports *wasn't* controversial until very recently after an astroturfed hate campaign, though. Like, conceding this ground isn't going "it's not the time to push for gains here" it's saying "the bigots are right" as your starting point despite it being trivial to argue back against.

I personally find that bigots aren't actually confused people. Transphobia isn't confusing that it's cruel and dehumanising. Transphobia is fascist and has connections to racism and eugenics. Transphobia is hate that is more important to a person than even their own human rights.

Reality never matters to these people. Abortion was mostly used by women who already have children not wild teens, late term and "post birth" were fantasies, and no one wants to use an expensive medical procedure as birth control. And yet here we are...

Grant the premise, and it can be extrapolated from there. We wouldn’t do it for “race realism” or any other bunk shit these freaks inundate us all with, so why do people think it makes sense to give any sort of leeway to an obviously genocidal endgoal?

Even assuming a trans girl is necessarily larger and stronger than cis girls, which isn't the case, it would only be unfair to other girls if she's _not a girl_ Otherwise, she'd simply be a large, strong girl, and they already have those.

The 'smallness' of it to me makes any attempt at legislation just feel all the more bizarre and spiteful. Half of these laws are specifically meant to hit, like, 5-6 kids, or literally zero in the case of the proposals for the WNBA. Why should we throw away rights forever just to hurt them?