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increasingly believing much of the communication gap between LLM Enthusiasts and LLM Skeptics on this website boils down to “are you someone who has largely experienced a *reasonable* amount of job security in tech, or are you someone who has not experienced job security and likely aren’t in tech”

I think this is super real, and I want the conversation to move here. The longer we stay in the "is it useful" debate, the longer we defer taking action to protect ourselves in a changed world.

I am pretty concerned about a world where there's only 2-3 companies that can run these models. I have been spending the last few days idly musing about a coop that sets up hardware and runs the open models.

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Bit premature maybe? If the big labs are losing money, a coop is both impractical (tokens at cost will be too expensive) and it is everybody's civic duty to help big labs lose more money by (ab)using free allowances and maxing paid plans.

iiuc the labs are making a net profit on inferrence (or at least on the paid stuff), and the losses are because they're pumping everything into training as fast as they can?

I suspect that this is, maybe, true for classic chatbot inference but not for reasoning models. It comes from the logic of the race too: better incrementally spend 2x on compute than be caught with your pants down being 2% behind on the benchmarks.

Considering everything is metered by the token I can't see why that would be true? Like, if you use a reasoning model you are either using more of your quota or straight-up being charged more directly. It shouldn't change anything meaningfully.

Heh I'm not quite so adversarial as the last half of your statement, especially since I think companies go through lifecycles during which their initial growth tends to produce more social value than they capture and so I wouldnt want to interrupt that - yet But yes it's premature atm

(Tongue planted firmly in cheek) if only there were a trustless decentralized mechanism for assuring service (preferably in TEEs) and a means to do global payments between providers and consumers

There’s a LOT of financial pressure behind architectural research that will make it easier to train and run all kinds of models (beyond just LMs) - I’m working at one such lab. I think we will see many approaches (and this one is one that’s necessary) come online in the next year or so.

frankly i’m already impressed by the models i can run on my phone. knowledge is an issue, but their ability to perform purely language-related tasks isn’t really all that far off the big models at all

You can run a decent model on 16 gigs of ram on a M series Mac now. Building agents is a lot like web dev, request response and doing things in between. I have enjoyed working with the smaller ones, it’s interesting what can be done.

one underappreciated fact is that there are like 100 “neoclouds” out there right now that you can go to and run open weights models

Regarding the employment future around software, it's hard to make predictions right now without knowing where the model capabilities land. I barely know how to think about hiring right now.

I think the cognitive load required to make something that conforms to your firms expectations will still require people regardless of how efficient these models are. Similar to how outsourcing your core product never really works I agree the future is less concentrated tech talent

My most optimistic take is that IT departments in non-software-oriented companies might be able to expand their scope to creating and maintaining inhouse software. Based on the level of expertise still required in the current generation of models, I think that's a reasonable idea

Somebody recently posted here about how people ai coding are able to solve their own needs but not make good software for other people. That tracks to me. That's where I think dedicated professionals could still be very necessary. Again, at the current model abilities.

This would essentially displace the saas industry and distribute the jobs outwards, and - you know, hopefully - lead to a better software industry, because shrinkwrapped software from megafirms sucks anyway

I'm definitely seeing the most utility with these things in "building myself bespoke and odd little software specifically for my little freak brain." Generalizing that to other people and explaining why I made those choices would be a LOT more complicated.

So I was thinking about this a little bit, and in particular about the opensource community and ecosystem. I'm starting to think that interfaces and governance are places where there's potential leverage for people to carve out their own economic space, or at least exert leverage.

It has made products for others and the barriers are not in the LLM but the human side of the equation. Strong systems thinkers can do it already and chainlink for example has many users

As a user experience/product designer, all I can say is: same as it ever was. The wonderful thing about programmers is they think unlike 95% of the population—the problem is that when they design software and its UI, they think unlike 95% of the population.

I mean, do we have to wait for capabilities to land somewhere? Seems like there is some monotonic increase wrt to compute scaling. So we can bet "capabilities will keep increasing." If we keep waiting for them to "land" we are going to be waiting till t -> inf. I just work backwards from:

"They will be able to do anything you can think of/speak/express." At that point SaaS becomes a triviality and we are dealing with the same type of problems we always have: "managing conflict and resources."

My company doesn’t do exactly this…but we’re getting kinda close, including fixing up inference projects to get decent MoE performance on the smallest possible yet still adequate infiniband connected systems. I guess DM if interested in the general sense?

I expect the models will become commodities. Open ones are not that far behind. I see the risk as that the companies de-skill huge numbers of people who become dependent on the convenience of their systems. Then the prices will start going up and the companies will manipulate their users.

new model (pun not intended) for hackerspaces: shared compute / LLM stuff I have wondered about a coworking space where everyone could hook up their compute and collectively power a distributed model

this is really cool, we could use Tailscale to hook up different exo instances. Network hops wouldn't be very good for long running compute, but still worth trying it out

This may become a necessity. Again, if models become "super intelligent" whatever the heck this means and there are only like 3 providers ... that is very very bad under the current conditions. We need to hedge ... but all the talent is concentrated there.

More than just running open models, there is an opportunity to provide small models trained for a specific task. Agents defined for a specific task, do not need a general purpose LLM. They can use a task specific model. This reduces training and inference costs.