Post

Imagine a person who voted for Trump: they love the racism, they love what ICE is doing, they eat up the smear campaigns. Or, they aren't the smartest, thought he would bring grocery prices down, at this point are pissed about either prices or ICE or both

In order to even do anything “humanely” ice still needs to be abolished

“Do you think this person would be persuaded by saying ‘abolish ICE?’” Honestly maybe! I’ll defer to the data but it seems intuitive to me that the average low-info Trump voter would be attracted to hyperbole and spectacle.

Primaries. Primaries for everyone. We scoop out the Polling-Brained Morons, and put in new brains that believe in driving policy by persuading their voters.

Fuck that.

Not a billionaire, but stopped donating to campaigns in the spring. I will not give a dime to a single Dem, even if I like/support them, because as a group, they are feckless, doddering idiots who cannot read the room (or the country). They can all bite me. Give exclusively to local causes now.

Holy fuck, we’re doomed. They’re going after voters who simply do not exist.

Adam Jentleson is an unimaginative and gullible rube if he thinks that ICE is at all involved in what he thinks they’re involved in.

Hear, Hear 👏👏👏👏👏

They already did position themselves more in line with maga voters in 2024!!! It didn't work!!! Why are people still pushing this line like *this time* it's suddenly going to work?!

Please don’t listen to Jentleson. I think he had something to do with Fetterman and he is one of the most disliked Democrats out there, right up with Cuellar.

He’s been a hack for awhile. And Trump voters aren’t getable.

You know there are a lot of swing voters and independents who voted for Trump right?

Adam Jentleson is fatally suspect because he helped birth and serve the turncoat, John Fetterman! Any 'guru' who has that on their record gets a 'hard pass' on any position they take on policy!

I think I'm going to say "fuck off, Nazis" if there are Nazis.

I'd post up a shocked Pikachu to represent Jentleson when J.D. Vance runs on being the Kinder Gentler MAGA(tm), but I wholly suspect he'll just jump on Team Vance at that point. Group chats and crypto donors, man.

Jesus Christ.

You mean lawfully and humane.

This is actually literally how Chuck Schumer decides his political positions.

And to bring in my thousands in consulting fees

So this person thinks political victories are more important than stopping fascism. If you don't abolish ICE we are still under fascism. Why do they not get this?

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

Also when you look at cross tabs on the issue Trump has overwhelming support for this violence and cruelty from two groups: Republicans and white men.

"...but I want it to be done humanely." Jesus H. Christ on a rubber raft. I can't think of anything else to say right now.

I generally don’t take seriously anyone who discusses policy on X.

Adam SHOULDN'T be listened to...at all.

He was Fetterman’s former Chief of Staff until they had a falling out.

Harry Reid has been out of office for nine years. If that's the top line of his resume, I'm going to go ahead and say he *is* nobody in terms of what "the Democrats" are doing. Maybe highlight things actual electeds are doing, like the several who are literally calling to abolish ICE.

Sad

He's one of the dipshits that thinks a "liberal" backlash online means he's doing the right thing. A guy who in any other country would be a member of the right-wing party. He hates the people who actually vote Democratic.

the aipac thread runs through it

You really can just say we have a right to control how many people we let into the country without saying immigrants are bad, or denying them basic rights. This is what most people think. It’s what we did in Canada - just slowed things down a bit to let housing catch up.

Oh no!

primarying bad dems means primarying whoever keeps hiring the peope who make these calls

I think the point where it all started to go wrong was when Gordon Brown was persuaded to apologise to small minded bigot Gillian Duffy for correctly describing her as a bigoted woman. The 'legitimate concerns' shtick validates your opponent's bigotry, leaving you to offer the watered down version.

@gelliottmorris.com Especially in a country where voting is voluntary and requires at least a little effort, it might be prudent to hang on to your traditional voters, the voters you share values with. Like, throwing people under the bus is a bad look.

how in gods name do they keep falling in the polls STILL

We didnt see this. They did.

AND WE ARE THE MAJORITY OF THIS COUNTRY!!

These are the people the out-of-touch, geriatric Democrats in the Senate listen to, aren't they? Speaking Mark Warner's and Dick Durbin's love language.

"Humane Immigration Enforcement" is a bit like "good slave owner". Little oxymorons that are meant to soften the cruel, bloody work that the institution demands. It's what dems will likely sell their voters on while they do nothing to their reduce funding, power or impunity.

The R voters who are horrified by ICE is a wafer-thin group. Most Rs are cheering for ICE. The biggest group of voters want health care, child care, and more tax on the wealthy. But so many dems don't want those voters. Didn't AJ used to work for Harry Reid? He sure lost his way.

How about the Democratic party doing the will of the dem voters for once instead of trying to chase some mythical disaffected MAGA voters? Pathetic.

Imagine a person who *didn't* vote for Trump. Now imagine that there are TWICE AS MANY OF THEM as those that did. You don't have to imagine, just stop listening to these stupid overpaid parasites, they're a cancer on the Democratic Party.

$40 million can also get you a cheesy Melania movie nobody wants to watch…

"Imagine a person" smh he's been talking to Schumer's Bailey family

blue is when you are paid to lose by the same people paying red to win

I don’t give a fuck about winning over “getable” Trump voters. I care about winning over the millions of young people who don’t vote because they think all the candidates are corporatist garbage.

Who is this?

I think this person will not be persuaded by anything but themselves, attempting to reach them is pointless.

Confusing*

Problem solving and position taking are different things. On most issues, voters don’t care about how you solve the problem as long as you signal that you are serious about it. These Dem consultants are taking Downs too literally. They should read Patrick Evan’s work.

Voters were unhappy with \what they were told about/ how the Biden admin governed on immigration. They were really upset with his "open borders" policy. Which didn't exist.

This is one guy. It’s not the Dems. Abolish ice it’s a Gestapo is much stronger than retrain ICE — that ain’t happening. The modeling of cruelty isn’t going away. #CoryBooker has lost his way on this as well.

It doesn't even occur to these people that the Overton window can move the other way.

Even by his own metric though he’s wrong A plurality of Americans (46%) want ice abolished, so even this imaginary friend of his would be more likely to want to abolish ICE lmao

It’s really: “imagine a voter who had no concept about the deportation push because the media never covered it in the election, but instead reported how Trump had magic plans to reduce inflation.” This is 95% of persuadable swing voters.

Wow that guy fuckin sucks

Turns out the guys who only care about the polling data no longer care about the polling data when the polling data supports doing things they think are cringe

Things like “abolish ICE” and “defund the police” just read like “we want anarchy!” to anyone who doesn’t understand what they really mean—which is most people. You want more votes, you need to explain to people why good things are good and bad things are bad because no, they really don’t know

The other thing is, you know who’s also up for grabs? A lot of fucking people to the left of centrist Democrats! And they will actually vote for Democrats unlike disappointed MAGA who will hate everything Trump does and still vote GOP

Dude - most of us dont have backers or friends. Stop with the ad hominems. People can disagree on this subject.

Nope. If you shift your stance on immigration to the right, the right will shift more to the right. And, these people will never come to you. Kamala Harris ran as a centrist candidate on immigration. It didn’t work at all. What an absolute idiot!

Gee, since we have literally running with that exact message since the mid terms, we kinda already know what those magic voters will do. Continue to vote Republicans.

Another losing strategy. Inspire your own party to get out and vote. Isn’t that a novel idea? You have no inspiration because you don’t have a clue what the people want. And by the way, if you don’t light a fire under your asses, there won’t be an election.

What does the polling say? All it will take is one or two more murders by undocumented immigrants to sway public opinion. Big time donors understandably don’t want to gamble with that possibility.

Agreed. It's hard to take these seriously..... as if the the person who voted for trump is *actually* turned off by what someone says. From trump I alone, countless pieces exist about how trump didn't mean what he actually said, and yet they voted for him. AGAIN. This is not the way. F this.

Ok I’m imagining him. He’s a republican. He will not vote for Democrats. What’s next?

The Corporate Democrats have lost to Trump twice. And their only win was a squeaker in the midst of a completely botched response to a pandemic that killed a million citizens. We don’t need any more evidence that they are incapable of connecting with voters.

This idiot is a writer and a former adviser to Fetterman. Ignore him. Please verify sources. It will save your blood pressure.

You can only do the 2nd part of that message by getting rid of everyone and every structure on ICE as it is today.

They *want* to have the raciat vote. Because they're racist. They don't want you to vote for them and are angry you're telling them to not be racist.

the strategists are courtiers and they do not serve voters

You'd think a consultant somewhere would remember the Swift Boat ads and think "huh, maybe attacking their strengths works"

JFC! Did they just hire the same consultants, pay them 10% more and fall for a PowerPoint that crossed out 2024 and wrote in 2026?

I am shocked that the people who want a strong Republican party would do this.

No consideration either for the fact that those people were lied to, told there were roving gangs of marauders attacking their cities. Seems like correcting this racist lie would be a higher priority than attacking random members of the community in fervent blood lust. But I’m not a consultant, so…

Future Forward raised a billion in 2024

Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory

I will not listen to any consultant/pundit/politician who does not understand that a common view held by republicans is: “I do not support [insert horrific policy or action] but I still agree with most of what he does and will still vote for the MAGA candidates”

Entire brain made of worms. “What about the voters that hate you? What are you going to do to get their vote?” What’s the last thing you think he believed in?

This not-really-hypothetical person (someone voting for a constitutionally disqualified rapist who had already tried to end the republic) has demonstrated such a lapse in judgment and such a lack of morality that their opinion on any other topic is not even worth considering.

That's not "Dems." That's stupid centrist Dems, like Jentleson. He should be sunned, as a matter of course.

Imagine a political commentator, who previously helped craft the loosing Kerry campaign, worked with Reid through the years Reid was continually outmaneuvered by McConnell, then worked along side Fetterman. Imagine this commentator crafting any compelling message of strength for the Democrats.

The idea that most swing voters were cranky about the economy and not really thinking about immigration just does not compute for them…

But they are absolutely convinced they need to appeal to those people. You absolutely cannot pursuade them.

I don’t know why this guy split with Fetterman. They seem perfect for each other

I don’t know of any Democrat, who’s saying that though. I do know of rank and file Dems who span the spectrum of “Abolish ICE” to “I don’t care about ICE.”

Adam understand his hypothetic voter represents about 25% of the population, right?

Political scientists need to study in a lab the mind virus that convinced Dem leadership that its impossible to harm your own voter turnout.

I agree with you. The only way to reform ICE is to re-form ICE. Abolish ICE doesn't have to mean permanently. It can, but all it has to mean is that ICE as constituted is rotten to the core and has to go.

@gelliottmorris.com "It’s no wonder that so many voters view Democratic candidates as weak. They rarely stand strongly for any specific set of beliefs/values/policies. They moderate, moderate, moderate in a feeble attempt to appeal to everyone, and end up appealing to no one." […]

I will never understand why they care more about the potential 2% of swing voters over the 30% who don't vote. Maybe if more people felt like their voices were heard they would want to participate.

“Imagine an imaginary voter...”

If dems ever figure out that border security and immigration reform are two completely separate issues, then they'll actually be on to something.

Anyone who was OK w Trump's "hardline" approach to immigration is not going to vote for Dems. The people who *are* up for grabs are the people who thought Biden/Harris were for open borders and/or no enforcement. Have to convince those folks. But can't start from "we will do hardline, but humanely"

The difference between a 1 party system and a 2 party system is an illusion of choice. "Your voice matters" they laughed

This is what we do. We listen to people that would never vote for us tell us what it would take for them to still not vote for us. And that is what we do.

This is inevitably what $40 million gets you, because people with $40 million are conservative regardless of what party they belong to or ideology they claim to have

Wealth is corrupts.

The funny part to me is that they think their second post is possible with ICE as it exists. Its ranks signed up to do what they are doing now, not the idealized law enforcement he's conjuring in his ideal smooth infinite plane. You can have your ideal, and you can have it w/out ICE.

At least something is accurate

Jentleson used to stand for something and give solid advice. Harry Reid would be mortified to see what his staffer became.

Dems have to be the most spineless political alignment in the world. Their party gives them absolutely nothing, yet they talk down to everybody as if they offer anything. Like in this image: does this useful idiot not see Dems did absolutely nothing about ICE and the wall? Its honestly baffling.

I agree with Adam- Abolish is not the message we need right now. We need to use this budget leverage opportunity! - No Masks, require Due Process, body cameras, clear identification and that they follow the judge’s rulings! - shut down the budget approva without all these @klobuchar.senate.gov

I guess my alternative idea here, which is entirely too good to be true, would be graciously ceding ground for an actual left party while they circle in as moderate conservative vultures waiting for the far right to rip itself apart

"policy positions of the avg MAGA voter" That's not what the post says, though? The average MAGA voter is not "horrified" by ICE's abuses.

Serious answer: If you pander to anti-immigrant sentiment, you validate the parties that are more anti-immigrant. That’s what’s happened to the Labour Party in their attempt to pander to Reform. Public opinion is influenced by salience politicians place on issues. So triangulation doesn’t work.

I mean either way there is a tidal wave of support for the Dems and activist base. if the Dems could put back together the Biden coalition they don't really need to steal maga voters. just energize their actual base for once. feels like the triangulation comes across as insincere

lol you got so excited to defend your fellow trust fund racist you forgot to actually include a question in your “serious Q”

To be clear, those motherfuckers are not "up for grabs", but they might get disillusioned about voting for their pet nazis if they are confronted with unified messaging that none of this is acceptable in America.

Mkay. Cuz people respond so well to nuance. 🤦‍♀️

Important remi that if Dem turnout in 24 had matched that of 20, Kamala would've won, and it wouldn't have even been close. Getting Dems and independents to turnout is what we should be focusing on. MAGA is gone forever. Only way they change is ending their fascist propaganda sources

What the wealthy actually want is a permanent exploitable underclass of illegal immigrants. What the people should want is immigrants with the same labor protections as citizens.

Why should there be so much ink wasted on hand wringing over the feelings of people who played stupid games and didn’t like they prize they won? what about all the people who said Trump was a fascist back in 2015? where are all the articles apologizing to them and finally giving proper credit?

Adam Jentleson was Fetterman’s COS. He’s a Republican in Democrats clothing, so I would just ignore him. He adds nothing to the conversation.

@gelliottmorris.com Ask the UK Labour Party how this plan is going for them…